TrishPO Top Contributor
Joined: 23 Sep 2020
Replies: 302
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Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2023 12:39 pm
Post subject:
| Sophia wrote: | Hi Marsha, Trish and Barb,
I would like to add a thought here. The record you posted is not actually a census record.
It appears to be from a civil registry book. In Polish archives the phrase for registry books is "księgi meldunkowe."
In German records, they can be called "Seelenliste" and in Polish "Lista dusz" both of which (if taken literally) mean "list of souls."
Unlike a census which is a snapshot in time, they were a living document - - when you went somewhere to live, you registered there. It was updated, as things changed. Your name would be crossed out if you moved away.
That is what you are seeing in the document for the Lewandowski family. The "Abgang" column shows the date of them leaving, and where they were going to. The place name looks to me like Inowroclaw.
There should be a registry book for Inowroclaw, showing the family living there, but I do not know if those records are available to you online.
Best regards,
Sophia |
Hi Sophia and Dave,
Sophia, thank you for the explanation of what the record was and how to read it.
Dave, thank you for the new link. I'll have to keep checking it to see if I find my towns on there.
Have a wonderful day!
Best regards,
Trish
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TrishPO Top Contributor
Joined: 23 Sep 2020
Replies: 302
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Posted: Wed Jul 05, 2023 1:54 pm
Post subject: Re: Searching for Martin Lewandowski
| travelwithme wrote: | | I have been searching for my grandparent's son, Martin Lewandowski, who was born in the year of 1871. According to a Polish census record, he was born in the town of Balin, Poland. His parents were Andreas Lewandowski and Lucia (Lewandowski) Lewandowski. I have searched Geneteka for him, but it seems that are no records of any kind for him...birth, marriage or death. I also searched for him in the US since his mom, as a widow, immigrated to the US in 1906 with her daughters. Twice I thought I might have found him in the US, but my request for his marriage records indicated different parents....it was the wrong Martin. Other than the census record, I have nothing else on him. Can anyone suggest where else or how else to search for him. I would greatly appreciate it. Thank you in advance. Marsha |
Hi Marsha,
I know you are looking for Martin, but I found the birth records for Franciszka and Jozef.
Franciszka Lewandowska
Born: 27 September 1876 in Gnojno
Record #124
DGS Film #007761755
Image #858
https://www.008018286familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3FZ-1?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-7Q8B
Jozef Lewandowski
Born: 26 February 1879 in Gnonjo
Record #41
DGS Film #007761755
Image #902
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3FH-W?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-949C
Have a great day!
Trish
Note: This post was updated and edited.
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Posted: Thu Jul 06, 2023 12:15 pm
Post subject:
Does it mean the records (Inowroclaw) are not available until later? When would I need to check back and would it be in Geneteka? But if Martin was born in Balin Poland shouldn't there be birth records there before the family moved to Inowroclaw? Does the "list of souls" ever have a date when it was recorded?
Thank you!!!
Marsha
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1035
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 5:22 am
Post subject:
| travelwithme wrote: | Does it mean the records (Inowroclaw) are not available until later? When would I need to check back and would it be in Geneteka? But if Martin was born in Balin Poland shouldn't there be birth records there before the family moved to Inowroclaw? Does the "list of souls" ever have a date when it was recorded?
Thank you!!!
Marsha |
Hi Marsha,
In answer to your last question, you can follow the dates within the document. Looking at the image that you posted, I would draw your attention to the columns just to the left and right of the center of the book. To the left, the column headings are:
Vorletzter Wohnort
Ort, Kreis
From this you know the place they were living prior to the town for which this book is documenting (I cannot tell, from the image, what place this is). The entry there for Andreas (and his family) is Slonsk, Inowroclaw, which you see is the same place where their youngest child was born, in 1881.
To the right, the column headings are:
Datum des Einzugs
Datum des Mitgebrachten Abzugs-Attestes
Abgang
Gestorben
Verzogen, wann und wohin, Ort, Kreis
Datum des Abzugs-Attestes
These columns are telling you the date they moved in (to the place which this book is documenting), which was 1/1/1882 and the date when they provided a certificate for that move, 8/1/1882 (that is not August 1rst, that is 8th January). "Abgang" means departure, so the first column beneath that word is used to record anyone's death, and the next two columns record when they left (1/1/1884) where they moved to (Inowroclaw) and when the certificate was issued (7/1/1884).
I hope this helps.
Have you gone back to where you got this document from, and looked for similar books for the other places that the children were born?
Best regards,
Sophia
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 7:42 am
Post subject: Dates on the List of Souls
Dear Sophia,
Your information is very helpful. So this sort of document in the past records when the family moved from Slonsk to Inowroclaw? So they registered for the move in 1882, but actually moved in 1884? I found this document in the following website:
https://www.genealogiawarchiwach.pl/. I searched for Martin Lewandowski by last name only on this site and in the Kujawsko-Pomorskie Volvodeship. Martin is listed under the town of Balin. I will revisit the site to search under these two other towns/cities. Thank you for all of your help. ---Marsha
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1035
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 7:49 am
Post subject: Re: Dates on the List of Souls
| travelwithme wrote: | Dear Sophia,
Your information is very helpful. So this sort of document in the past records when the family moved from Slonsk to Inowroclaw? So they registered for the move in 1882, but actually moved in 1884? I found this document in the following website:
https://www.genealogiawarchiwach.pl/. I searched for Martin Lewandowski by last name only on this site and in the Kujawsko-Pomorskie Volvodeship. Martin is listed under the town of Balin. I will revisit the site to search under these two other towns/cities. Thank you for all of your help. ---Marsha |
Hi Marsha,
You almost have it, but not quite.
1882 is when they moved in to this place, and 1884 is when they moved out of it.
Every town will have its own book. When you moved to a town, they recorded when you arrived (and where you lived before that). When you left that town, they recorded when you left (and where you were headed).
Does that clear it up for you?
All the best,
Sophia
P.S. Genealogiawarchiwach is a huge site. Could you please just provide me a link, to the image?
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 8:45 am
Post subject: A Helpful List of the Lewandowski Family
Hi, Some how I believe this attached list I found has the list of the children, including Martin, of Andreas and Lucia Lewandowski. I think it may have an important clue as to where the family lived, but I am not sure what the document was used for. Can you tell me anything more about this and what the number 17 must mean associated with each family member? Thank you. ---Marsha
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1035
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 8:48 am
Post subject: Re: A Helpful List of the Lewandowski Family
| travelwithme wrote: | | Hi, Some how I believe this attached list I found has the list of the children, including Martin, of Andreas and Lucia Lewandowski. I think it may have an important clue as to where the family lived, but I am not sure what the document was used for. Can you tell me anything more about this and what the number 17 must mean associated with each family member? Thank you. ---Marsha |
Hi Marsha,
You see the column heading says "str" which means "strona," which is Polish for page.
So they will be on page 17.
Again, if you provided a link to the image, instead of only the image, it would allow me to look at the whole document and see what the thing actually is.
Sophia
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 11:35 am
Post subject: Links to the documents
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1035
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Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 12:53 pm
Post subject: Re: Links to the documents
Thanks, Marsha, that helped.
Your second link, which you labelled "List of Children of Andreas and Lucia" is part of the index of the book. Your first link, which you labelled "List of Souls," is a page from that book. The book is the "Lista Dusz" for the town of Latkowo. (You can see this, if you look at the first page of the book. Also it is acknowledged in the notes on the right side of the page: "Unit full name Lista dusz - Latkowo.")
If you look at that page, you will see in the upper-right corner that its original handwritten page number was 17, hence the 17 in the index. At some point in its history, it must have been added to another stack of pages and the 17 was crossed out and it became page 33, and the same thing happened again and it became page 36.
I hope this helps.
Sophia
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BarbOsloPO Top Contributor
Joined: 19 Nov 2022
Replies: 717
Location: NorwayBack to top |
Posted: Fri Jul 07, 2023 3:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Polish Census Record
| BarbOslo wrote: | | travelwithme wrote: | | Hi Barb, It is good to be in touch with you once again. Thank you for writing. I have attached the Polish census record of the family and #4 lists Martin Lewandowski and the town of Balin where he was born. Other than that I do not know and cannot find anything on him. I was hoping he immigrated to the US around the same time his mother did in 1906, but cannot find anything. Thank you for your help once again. |
Hi Marsha,
Nice to hear from you.
Have you found the birth records for Martin's other siblings?
3 villages are mentioned in this census record. All are located a short distance from each other. Mulingen that all three births were registered in the same parish. I think so. Based on location I would think it is Inwroclaw. Unfortunately I didn't find anything there. Inowrclaw is a big town and I didn't check out all the parishes. Last night I sent an email to the State Archives Bydgoszcz department Inowroclaw with questions about localization. I will contact you as soon as I receive a reply from the archive. I guess it will take up to a week.
Also thinking about emigrating to the USA. You mentioned that Lucia came to the US in 1906 with two daughters. If Martin did not come with his mother and sisters, then I would check an earlier journey for him around 1902-1905.
Have a nice weekend,
-Barb |
Hello Marsha,
I received a reply from the Registry office in Bydgoszcz, branch of Inowroclaw. According to them, Balin belongs to the parish of St. Nikolai Inowroclaw and Registry office Inowroclaw - village (Polish Inowroclaw wies). Remember that the Registry offices in Poland started in the autumn of 1874, so Martin's birth record can only be found in the church.
I did not find Martin in Inowroclaw in 1871. Maybe 1872 needs to be checked as well in case he was born at the end of the year and was baptized the following year.
-Barb
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Posted: Sat Jul 08, 2023 4:28 pm
Post subject: Balin
Hi Barb,
Thank you for the chart. Where would I need to continue to look for his church record around 1871 or 1872?
Marsha
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TrishPO Top Contributor
Joined: 23 Sep 2020
Replies: 302
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Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2023 11:54 am
Post subject: Re: Balin
| travelwithme wrote: | Hi Barb,
Thank you for the chart. Where would I need to continue to look for his church record around 1871 or 1872?
Marsha |
Hi Everyone,
I had given Marsha all the records listed below. I am posting them in hopes that someone can help find Martin's birth record. Maybe I missed it.
I hope this helps some.
Trish
Andrzej Lewandowski Birth – November 11, 1843 - Gnojno
DGS Film: 007761755 – Image: 806
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-PWQN-Q?i=805&cc=4116415&cat=1046085
Andrzej Lewandowski Death
DGS Film: 008018838 – Image: 62
Note: Parents are Lucas Lewandowski & Agnieszka Nowak
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSXD-T3ZT-B?i=61&cc=4116415&cat=1046488
Children of Andrzej Lewandowski and Lucja Lewandowska
Marianna Lewandowska Birth – August 2, 1869 – Gnojno
DGS Film: 007761755 – Image: 743
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3FN-B?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-D5MH
Marianna Lewandowska Marriage – November 20, 1894
DGS Film: 007761938 - Image: 516
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMW-62CK?cc=4116415
Katarzyna Lewandowska Birth – April 2, 1874 - Gnojno
DGS Film: 007761755 – Image: 819
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3F6-G?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-HTKZ
Franciszka Lewandowsa Birth - Born: 27 September 1876 in Gnojno
Record #124, DGS Film #007761755, Image #858
https://www.008018286familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3FZ-1?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-7Q8B
Franciszka Lewandowska Marriage - May 5, 1895 (? Date)
DGS Film: 007761938 – Image: 519
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMW-62Q7?cc=4116415
Jozef Lewandowski Birth - Born: 26 February 1879 in Gnonjo
Record #41, DGS Film #007761755, Image #902
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMM-R3FH-W?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FHY-949C
Lucja Lewandowska Birth – August 5, 1881 –
DGS Film: 008018286 – Image: 77
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSX8-YPZ1?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FCD-D9MS
Lucja Lewandowska Marriage – September 21, 1902 –
DGS Film: 007761938 - Image: 551
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSMW-62KC?i=550&cc=4116415
Franciszek Lewandowski Birth – June 7, 1884 -
DGS Film: 008018286 – Image: 220
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSX8-YG7C?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FC8-RY56
Franciszek Lewandowski Death – August 25, 1884 -
DGS Film: 008122015 – Image: 846
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSVF-W7NT-6?cc=4116415&personaUrl=%2Fark%3A%2F61903%2F1%3A1%3A6FZ8-B7BF
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Posted: Sun Jul 09, 2023 12:31 pm
Post subject:
Hi Trish,
Perhaps I could search for a marriage record of Martin first? Then it might tell me more in order to find a birth or death record. It doesn't appear for now that he immigrated to the US since what ever records I found were not the correct Martin Lewandowski, son of Andreas and Lucia Lewandowski. (I did find that Lucia's brother, Stephen Lewandowski (born 1852) did come to Milwaukee and remarried.) Thank you for all of the work you are putting into this to help me. --Marsha
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SophiaPO Top Contributor
Joined: 05 Oct 2014
Replies: 1035
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Posted: Mon Jul 10, 2023 7:26 am
Post subject:
Hi Everyone,
If you are following the movement of the Lewandowski family, you recall that the image of the registry book that Marsha posted has them moving in to the town of Latkowo in January 1882 and moving out in January 1884. It looks like the place to which they moved is written as Inowroclaw.
Trish provided a link for Franciszek Lewandowski's birth in June 1884. He would be the first of their children born in that place. If you look at the column that provides his place of birth, you may be thinking that it does not look at all like "Inowroclaw" and yet it is. What is written there is actually "Junivladisl" and that means the same thing. You can see that here, at the beginning of the book in which Franciszek's birth record appears:
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSX8-YPTG?i=5&cc=4116415
which has the Latin, "Ecclesiae parochialis Junivladislaviensis" and the later addition, "Inowroclaw." You also see written there "Hohensalza" which is the German form of the town name.
Best regards,
Sophia
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